Fever

1y

Dictionaries often do not have scientific definitions, and definitions vary wildly between scientific fields and within psychology disciplines. In my grad program I would have lost points using a dictionary term for anything lol

Your definition does not describe the mind well enough, but the primary issue is that it is inherently outdated due to the assumptions of what 'mind' means. It needs to be defined in a way that includes objectivity, and 'mind' is often considered a false concept. If we are talking about mental processes with their effects of physical processes, then it becomes more usable.

BUT - the biggest problem is that definition rejects determinism. You can't have modern psychology without that.

If that isn't philosophical enough, I don't mind breaking down more on this.

edit

might as well put this in now to help move the conversation forward a little

Skinner was influenced by John B. Watson’s philosophy of psychology called behaviorism, which rejected not just the introspective method and the elaborate psychoanalytic theories of Freud and Jung, but any psychological explanation based on mental states or internal representations such as beliefs, desires, memories, and plans. The very idea of “mind” was dismissed as a pre-scientific superstition, not amenable to empirical investigation. Skinner argued that the goal of a science of psychology was to predict and control an organism’s behavior from its current stimulus situation and its history of reinforcement. In a utopian novel called Walden Two and a 1971 bestseller called Beyond Freedom and Dignity, he argued that human behavior was always controlled by its environment. According to Skinner, the future of humanity depended on abandoning the concepts of individual freedom and dignity and engineering the human environment so that behavior was controlled systematically and to desirable ends rather than haphazardly.

wild

1y

i'm 34 years old. i started learning about philosophy and psychology when i was 14 years old after i was diagnosed with depression. my dad recommended it and said it would help manage my mental health. learning about philosophy definitely helped me a lot more than psychology and eventually my depression went away because of it.

i was raised roman catholic, but in my teenage years, i was agnostic/atheist. i went through different phases later on as a pantheist, panentheist, buddhist, and taoist. my favorite philosophers changed over time, but i was mostly inspired by soren kierkegaard, rene descartes, baruch spinoza, david hume, george berkeley, buddha, lao tzu, and the stoics.

i'm not young and depressed anymore, so i stopped learning about philosophy and psychology. i started practicing roman catholicism again because i want to be in the same religion as my family and develop a deeper connection with them. i used to be more interested in philosophy and psychology than music and anime/manga when i was younger, but now it's the reverse.

wild

1y

are you a determinist?

wild

1y

i'm 34 years old. i started learning about philosophy and psychology when i was 14 years old after i was diagnosed with depression. my dad recommended it and said it would help manage my mental health. learning about philosophy definitely helped me a lot more than psychology and eventually my depression went away because of it.

i was raised roman catholic, but in my teenage years, i was agnostic/atheist. i went through different phases later on as a pantheist, panentheist, buddhist, and taoist. my favorite philosophers changed over time, but i was mostly inspired by soren kierkegaard, rene descartes, baruch spinoza, david hume, george berkeley, buddha, lao tzu, and the stoics.

i'm not young and depressed anymore, so i stopped learning about philosophy and psychology. i started practicing roman catholicism again because i want to be in the same religion as my family and develop a deeper connection with them. i used to be more interested in philosophy and psychology than music and anime/manga when i was younger, but now it's the reverse.

Fever

1y

I saw you are catholic in that last comment, we have no reason to continue this conversation. Though, I will say, that is one of the fundamental dimensions of psychology.

You most likely will never agree or objectively view the field as a result, and that is okay, but I don't see any reason to continue this now.

And not in a rude way or anything, but I have been explicitly clear that I am a behaviorist. I've referenced Skinner multiple times. You claimed to have studied psychology, you know what that means.

wild

1y

go look it in up in a dictionary. it's the truth. if the dictionary says so, then it must be true. you're just being a contrarian to try to be cool and different.

Fever

1y

I saw you are catholic in that last comment, we have no reason to continue this conversation. Though, I will say, that is one of the fundamental dimensions of psychology.

You most likely will never agree or objectively view the field as a result, and that is okay, but I don't see any reason to continue this now.

And not in a rude way or anything, but I have been explicitly clear that I am a behaviorist. I've referenced Skinner multiple times. You claimed to have studied psychology, you know what that means.

wild

1y

i'm a progressive catholic, so i'm open to discussing about determinism, because i used to be a determinist when i was younger when i read baruch spinoza. he was a pantheist and a determinist. i'm probably a compatibilist and think determinism and free will are compatible.

wild

1y

skinner was one of the first people i read when i started getting into psychology because he is a big name in the field. it was so long ago, but i thought he was interested at first until i got deeper into philosophy so i stopped learning about him. i'm more educated in clinical psychology than behaviorism though.

Fever

1y

What Skinner works stuck with you? Or even specific concepts, findings?

It's intriguing to me you read old stuff like that when it predates so much currently. Of course he shaped modern psychology, but it's more like he just started it off and was the dude to realize first that humans look at our 'mind' in the wrong way.

wild

1y

the pigeon experiment

what other psychologists do you like besides skinner?

Fever

1y

Which pigeon study? Or do you mean all the skinnerbox studies? He did use other animals too though.

I wouldn't say I have like, favorite researchers? There's a lot of works and study series I like. I guess I'm a big fan of Hanley, then Pavlov of course had a groundbreaking realization but I dislike how frequently 'classical' conditioning is taught since it's a b******ized term at this point as a result (which doesn't even fully explain the process anyways).

I point to skinner in this thread since he's essentially the godfather of modern psychology, and led to extreme developments across all disciplines, even the ones attempting to challenge his philosophy to this day.

I mean I can go dig through my article Google drive folder and stuff I guess. Most the research I read or use is for applied settings though.

wild

1y

i forgot how the experiment went, but i just remember that he did something with pigeons.

i'm not that interested in behaviorism right now. maybe back then when i was still a pantheist/determinist i would've learned more about skinner. i'm more of a carl jung person when it comes to psychology.

ice cold

1y

how you came to this conclusion?
what's your mbti?
i think you might be on the spectrum

RICH

1y

Are you @vicenvibes ?

Fever

1y

Psych eval 100% to start with. I reccomend this often if clients start to engage in observable mood swings.

I don't diagnose, but after a diagnosis occurs I write treatment with collaborating with other psychologists in different specializations. Since I don't know enough to diagnose, I regularly have to put in medical requests like this first.

Also, a psychologist is a medical professional. I practice healthcare too. If you go to a primary doctor or whatever, they will just refer to the specialist - being a psychologist who does evaluations, maybe specifically with mood disorders even.