I'm saying that in any market, most people don't have a say. It's the people with the most money that do

he just wants everyone to be happy and equal.

i'll even take being called a 2nd grader at this point

i simply want to know why im leaving my family at home for 40 hours a week, breaking my back at 4 in the morning to build all these houses

Is your third option leaving it to the people?(as per your later replies)

most likely nothing

Yes

It's not like it's relevant or anything, but he's discussed working before and a lot of people don't have jobs right now, but you don't know whether he's working right now or not

he’ll have to say something about radically shifting society so that people naturally choose to put The Greater Good™ above their own desires

But then it no longer becomes equal. When some people have to work more for the good of others than others do, and get the same things from the government in return, this is literally not equal

vague notions of everyone banding together are very noble but let's get down to the nitty gritty

There is nothing credible about this thread until the OP starts discussing opposing views in good faith, which he has failed to do for 33 pages

Mods, please lock it up

Why would someone study to become a surgeon or engineer when they could just do something basic and get the same thing in return? The hard jobs need some sort of reward and that reward is money

exactly

I'm busy dumbass I plan on responding when I get on my laptop

Because they like doing those things? It's not as if ppl will suddenly stop being engineers or having knowledge of how to do surgery

I don't think that was implication of socialism. It was that you get paid equally for the same profession. USSR didn't pay everyone the same.

They also graduated a lot more STEM people than us during it's existence, to play devil's advocate.

What opposing views? The ones that say landlords are just trying to make a living?

i like what i do for work but i like kicking the footy at the park more.

im not going anymore.

Yes, they will. There are definitely important jobs where the majority of people work it because of the prospect that they will get paid well over doing something basic. I don’t know why this is hard to understand unless money does not motivate you at all to work hard

jobs that aren't exploiting others?

I don’t work 12 hour days as a software engineer because “I enjoy it” I do it because they pay me 6 figures and the harder the work the more I will get paid. Very simple concept. If they don’t pay me more, what motivation do I have to work harder?

the one thing i will say is, gotta thank syn for making this thread, totally kept me entertained while working today

says who?

you only think profit is the motive because thats what we're conditioned to believe in society, but there's nothing that says that is fundamental to human nature. it's just as likely that laboring is a central part of our fulfillment as human beings and this might even be doubly the case when we get to reap the full benefits of our labor and see those rewards manifest in our communities.