Carti is really essentially the only one that can remotely compare, and he doesn’t beat out Kendrick, Cole or Drake in literally any of the things that I just mentioned besides influence for Cole, (?) you literally agree with me but just don’t wanna admit it pretty much lol

you can blame Gucci Thug and whoever else not being high on an all time list on “Southern hate” or whatever else, but it doesn’t add up because like i said, every other genre essentially has this exact standard

they’re definitely legends, but they aren’t on par with any of the dudes that are typically mentioned on an all-time list

being a legend and an all time great are two different things lol

technically gifted includes the ability to flow (which is really just a melody pretty much) lyricism, entering in and out of cadences effortlessly, understanding tone and pace etc. Eminem definitely could do it all, maybe that’s just your own myopic understanding of technical rapping i guess

Nobody was blown away because of the aesthetic. Like honestly that s*** is such a lazy argument.

I was in like 5th or 6th grade when Tyler first popped off and the music was hard af to me back then. I didn’t give a f*** if he was wearing supreme or any of that s***. French, sandwiches, all that was hard to 11 year old me.

And I’ve seen you call Cartis aesthetic drawn out or exaggerated. What’s drawn out about it?

there’s more evidence for my claim than there is for yours though, is sort of my overarching point lol

carti doesn’t bring anything to the table on par with a Kanye, that would allow him to get put in an all time list over a whole bunch of arguably better artists

you citing a bunch of older simplistic music while calling me an oldhead is absolutely hilarious—but anyways no one really holds that older simplistic music in high regards like they do with Illmatic, The Blueprint or College Dropout, To Pimp A Butterfly etc. probably because it lacked good writing

that’s kinda the thing

saying carti can compare but thug gucci and future cant is f***ing bonkers
obviously the guy thats been around for 6/7 years cant compare to the guys that have had buzz since 2007/9

it does add up u have literally 0 argument against it they are all time greats whether you like it or not, and they have more direct influence than most of the guys you named
they are all time greats
no understanding tone isnt technical rap skill, how do you not even know this part?
Ka is arguably top 4 greatest technical rappers of all time, why? its because his rhyme schemes,wordplay, lyricism
its basically if i read this on a paper what can i a***yze

like basically the dude is trying to say that Carti is ushering in a new era of vibes based non-lyrical rap and that what we know as hip-hop is going to completely change

like they said the same things about Wayne, and then it was Thug & Future, and then it was Uzi, Kodak and Carti, but it always regresses to the means of some sort of artist with mass appeal that has a strong pen that people end up praising the s*** out of lol

I mean the whole argument of “this is really pushing and growing the culture” falls apart easily because we literally have the numbers that prove it’s not

It took young thug like 6 or 7 years to get a number one. Arguably the most important rapper of the last decade

…i didn’t really consider Thug, Gucci and Future as newer gen artists, but they don’t really compare to Kendrick, Cole (to a lesser extent? i don’t really like Cole) or Drake like that at all lol

what is the argument that you’re making then? you’re saying that the big 3 is no longer carrying hip-hop, and yet you keep defaulting to “well just give it time bro, he hasn’t gotten started bro, u gotta wait” if you’re saying there has to be more time for things to develop, that’s an implicit concession that they’re in fact the dudes that are pretty much still carrying the genre

you can call them all time greats if you like, i don’t really care that much, they just don’t compare to a Nas or a JAY-Z which has kinda been my point this entire time

if understanding tone isn’t considered a crucial aspect of songwriting at all, then i guess all of those jazz singers that sang standards back in the day had no idea what they were doing when they would interpret these songs and turn them into their own thing, or outright completely transform the song into something different from the original, you got it lol

it’s pretty much just sticking your hand in the sand and screaming as loud as you can so you don’t have to face the reality of the situation

carti can’t just be an artist that makes pretty good stuff, he has to be a misunderstood all time tier artist that is getting unfairly hated on by the oldheads on here (and the hate really is just not d***riding shamelessly pretty much)

except your evidence means jack s***, your whole s*** is flawed

who says that though. You? yes i am referencing older music, it doesnt make me an old head to do that lol. whos higher on an alltime list is subjective. I dont care about your preference in music its worthless to me. The question is their legacy and place in the genre. There are plenty of legends(which im using interchangeably with a great) in every genre that arent focused on lyrics, those were multiple examples. I dont care what rap nerds hold in high regard, yall have s***ted on the music thats most core to where the genre comes from for years and theres a million biases and dumb criteria that determines this- the fact that your examples are all basic artsy core projects like to pimp a butterfly, the blueprint, college dropout shows me just how shallow your knowledge really is. You have no ability to process any of the levels im trying to take you to. Those people are still cemented in history and core figures of hip hop and music as a whole for what they did
and they did it WITHOUT a lyrical focus
There are plenty of rnb singers who are just great ass singers and are cemented because of that
Plenty of rock bands thats lyrics were damn near nonsense especially when you get into slacker rock, progressive rock, metal, punk rock, especially poppier acts that are still deserving of a high spot there and are essential to the history of the genre.

Absolutely not Carti doesn't have the range, he arguably makes the same song every time

Not drawn out but just goofy. A grown ass man pretending to be an edgy vampire? Lmao

And regardless of what you personally thought about Tyler’s aesthetic it was absolutely a huge selling point to kids

They dont to you.
The big 3 arent carrying hip hop lol they just sell really well cuz they have great machines and everyone knows their name that doesnt mean they are carrying the genre there is plenty of great stuff aside from them, if they left actually it would probably allow for something else to get to that level. (how can cole and kendrick carry hip hop at all when both are barely dropping anyway? its not like off season lasted that long and mr morale was great but there was a 5 year gap where rap was still the largest genre on earth, there has been plenty great around that time too it just was big)
They do compare. Gucci mane thug future are all legends just as much as nas is. The guy who had one f***ing album. I didnt say understanding tone wasnt a part of songwriting, i said its not a part of technical rap skill. Nice try though bro I don't even know how you misread that

Kanye is different than Carti because he utilizes people and crafts great s*** (most of the time), Carti doesn't give af like that

His influence on others was immediate and a lot of them did bigger numbers then him

It’s like if Ken and Lonely started doing numbers way above Cartis

tone darling, tooone

you dont know what carti puts into his music lol none of us do but it seems pretty calculated and its p obvious he locks in with talented people. But yeah, kanye does utilize people. Like how half his career and "great written" stuff was done by rhymefest, pardi, cyhi, among others and his own input has been minimal since 2010.

How is he pretending to be a vampire? Because he’s wearing Rick Owen’s and Givenchy s***? The vampire s*** comes from the movie lost boys. He said he liked the outfits in the movie. He’s not pretending to be a literal vampire.

And nobody besides RYM type snobs listen to music for aesthetics. That’s a purely online thing that sad adults do. No kid is doing that if they don’t genuinely like the music

Carti is primarily focused on the brand or aesthetic, like WLR being distorted.

Kanye does things like this too like the mixing on MBDTF and Yeezus, but he also crafts phenomenal s*** on top of that

funny how i never said that, it has been the case this is changing. Again, stop misrepresenting me because i refuse your actually this f***ing dumb and not doing this with malicious intent. In your circles, they may praise the pen more. Your bubble or internet rap nerd circles arent reflective of reality everywhere

They both “craft” phenomenal s***. Why you think Ye fw Carti so much.

Carti is all aesthetic and no substance
Travis is all production and no substance
Kanye (for a bulk of his career) had aesthetic, production, substance, lyrics etc

no, they do to most people lol

when people think of all time great artists they aren’t thinking of Thug, Future or whomever, they are thinking of niggas like JAY-Z and Nas’ niggas that have shown an ability to write introspective s***, make hits, wordplay, essentially the entire package, it’s never contained to just melodic enjoyment and vibes my guy lol

the machine is the reason why Kendrick just came off a sold out tour? same with Drake? are you gonna keep it a stack with me right now? there’s no other reason you can fathom why people still actively anticipate their music above all the other newer artists currently in the genre?

you don’t even have a coherent argument at this point man, we’re discussing songwriting, technical rapping ability is a facet of songwriting, a facet of technical rapping ability is understanding tone because understanding tone is a part of songwriting

focused on the brand
describes an element of the sound of a part of his last album

I cannot handle you people

Because Carti is the one that the internet loves right now. This is no different than Kanye f***ing with XXX and Tekashi in 2018

Kanye attaches himself to anyone that's popping it's not just Carti