Lovely argument. I’m glad we are having a productive conversation here.

We abolish the state with PEACEFUL protest and then there is a kumbaya and we all live happily ever after and no capitalists want their power back

this ain't a debate club lmao, you can continue to live in fantasy land

this is a strawman lol no one is arguing for this.

You are a rad lib

No i’m a communist that would like to avoid authoritarianism at all costs.

Then explain your non-revolutionary, non-"authoritarian" way to reach communism

they abolish the state with PEACEFUL protest and then there is a kumbaya and they all live happily ever after and no capitalists want their power back

Even capitalists/liberals had their share of revolutions and civil wars

French Revolution out now
American revolution out now

Either that or they set an "Abolish the state" Referendum and vote it into law through simple majority.

India was not peaceful, it only worked bc motherfuckers were bombing British s*** all day and revolting for decades. Ghandi was the concession made by the British.

Sure. I think market socialism would he an appropriate step that could be made in the US currently. Democratize the workplace! Workers seizing the means or production! Putting the economy in the hands of the proletariat.

no, he asked you how youre going to reach that

well that’s step 1 bucko

i could keep going but id like to see his reply to that first

What? no thats the product. how do you get to market socialism? what measures are you using.

how will you democratize the workplace

Coops are a nice measure in the meanwhile but at some point u will need to cross the rubicon.

And obviously it wont change the dominant system

AH. That’s the tough part. As cringe as it may be, working within the establishment might just be the way to go. It worked back in the day. Thanks to the american socialist of the past we were able to optain more rights for workers under the FDR presidency (if i’m remembering that correctly).

Yup there we go

Right. The state would need to come into play, but they won’t be seizing the means of production.

Because socialists were so radical and threatening that the New Deal was a CONCESSION.

Same with Ghandi. The alternaitive was much more threatening to the UK.

You are trying to negotiate without any ace in your hand. You need leverage. Communists, real communists, were leverage until the 90s. The threat that loomed over bourgeois heads.

The European welfare states all regressed in the 90s when the USSR collapsed. Coincidence? No.

Indeed. Sky’s the limit at that point though.

no, you f***ed up at thinking youll achieve even some b******ized form of socialism (which is what "market socialism" is) through working with the establishment. jesus christ

as an Indian I hate Gandhi so much man